David Attenborough vs Creationism
The naturalist joined three Nobel laureates, the atheist Richard Dawkins and other leading scientists in calling on the government to tackle the “threat” of creationism.
Gordon Brown’s government issued guidance to all schools that the subject should not be taught to pupils, but neither they nor the coalition government enshrined the recommendation in law.
In a statement on a new campaign website, the 30 scientists and campaign groups including the British Science Association demanded creationism and “intelligent design” be banned outright.
Prof Colin Blakemore, the neurobiologist, Sir Paul Nurse, the President of the Royal Society, and former Royal Society director of education Rev Prof Michael Reiss were among the signatories.
I couldn’t agree more. Creationism is a load of religious, pseudo-scientific crap, which has been completely discredited. It shouldn’t just have no place in schools, the state should indeed prevent it by law. America is being corrupted by the growing trend of fact denial; in school children in this country should only be taught to critically evaluate the world around them. There’s no other rational position to take.
Students vs Richard Dawkins
So the students, as expected, came for Richard Dawkins last night. Here’s why:
A group of well-known academics are setting up a private college in London which will charge students £18,000 a year in tuition fees. There will, as usual, be scholarships for the deserving poor. As a kind of Oxbridge by the Thames, the New College of the Humanities will offer students weekly one-on-one tutorials. For that kind of money, I would demand a team of live-in, round-the-clock tutors, ready to fill me in about Renaissance art or logical positivism at the snap of a finger. I would also expect them to iron my socks and polish my boots.
There will, however, be teaching from 14 “star” professors as well, including Linda Colley, Christopher Ricks, Richard Dawkins, Niall Ferguson and David Cannadine. Somehow it’s hard to imagine these guys rolling in at 9am and teaching for 12 to 15 hours a week, which is what you do in the real Oxbridge. Prospective students should talk to these professors’ travel agents and insist on obtaining photocopies of their diaries. Students can, however, be fairly relaxed about the prospect of being kicked out. It would be like JK Rowling being kicked out by her publishers.
New College of course is an odious idea – you get an ‘Oxford’ education with ‘star’ professors, with the bonus of it being in London, but only if you can afford it. And indeed with academics notorious for turning up when (and if) they choose, how often will superstars like Dawkins actually turn up? At a time when the higher education system is being fundamentally marketised, Dawkins et al, including the ‘master’ of the school AC Grayling, have decided that rather than rock the boat and stand up to the Tories, they’d much rather just go along with it and make a tidy profit.
Last night Dawkins and PZ Myers held a public discussion under the auspices of the British Humanist Association, at the Institute of Education. Unsurprisingly the topics of discussion were evolution, atheism and to please their fawning audience they did as much as they could to say offensive things about religion. But before they even had a chance to start, the gathering was invaded by students, outraged at Dawkins’ participation in Grayling’s venture. They clearly intended to sabotage the evening, and expected the backing of the audience. When they started facing increasingly abusive heckling back, and eventually a full audience rebellion against them, they were quite bewildered and got increasingly petulant.
What they didn’t get was that a significant proportion of the audience agreed with them: Dawkins’ participation in the NCH venture is vile, but the battle against Tory marketisation of higher education wasn’t to be had there that night. Most people were there to learn (ironically for free) from the star professors, or just to be entertained – as one irate man pointed out: it would have made more sense to attack Michael Gove, not Richard Dawkins. Much of the audience agreed with the invaders, but were there for entertainment and intellectual stimulation despite their misgivings about the evolutionary biologist’s decision. We’re complex beings – it’s entirely possible to enjoy someone for their talents, whilst disagreeing with wrong minded decisions they’ve taken. He was eventually successfully challenged in the auditorium and tried to defend his case, but did so poorly. He came across partly as an Oxford elitist who didn’t understand how the other 90% lived, but mostly as a typical academic on a different planet to everyone else.
It’s entirely possible that his standing against the Tories may not change anything about education policy in the UK. But if he’s so laissez-faire about marketisation, why not offer his star services to somewhere like London Metropolitan University, now on the brink of disaster? I’m sure a university prepared to cut 4 5ths of its courses would bend over backwards to accommodate whatever teaching system he thinks is so vital to important to export to London. But of course that’s not the point. Dawkins is going along with Grayling because he doesn’t understand what’s really important for most young people in higher education, (his precious ‘Oxford style’ is a red herring) and that helping to set up what might be a whole tranche of private universities for the rich and elite fundamentally undermines the mainstream system he professes to care about. Every member of Dawkins’ & Myers’ audience must have understood that as well, but by arguing that ‘Richard Dawkins insults the whole world’ the students opposed to him shot themselves cleanly in the foot.
Richard Dawkins Answers Reddit Questions
It’s the last question that’s by far the best – at 11:30 – quite hilarious. Just watch Dawkins reading his hate mail out in an armchair, in front of an open fire. Was one of them from @JoeCienkowski?
Creationists are Just Plain Stupid
As many of you know, Joe Cienkowski is quite possibly the stupidest of all the stupid creationists on the Internet. For reasons known only to him (and them) he seems desperate to prove that evolutionary biologist Prof Richard Dawkins actually supports their outrageous, baseless philosophy. Of course that’s nonsense. Let’s start a rebuttal by showing what Dawkins thinks of creationists:
Of creationists he says: ‘a mind like that…it seems to me is…well…a disgrace to the human species’. Hmm. That doesn’t sound very supportive of intelligent design or creationism. For that matter, have a watch of Jim (@movingtomontana) Gardner’s video (at about 2:47), showing Dawkins himself utterly and completely refuting any vague hint of belief in intelligent design in any way:
Given Dawkins’ own comments it would be pointless to attack Joe’s petulant footstamping line by line. Instead I’m going to offer you a smattering of viewpoints utterly breaking the preposterous notion of design. First we have Neil deGrasse Tyson, reflecting on the stupidity of ‘design’:
Then there’s Randolph Nesse (with Dawkins) showing yet again how the eye could not possibly have been ‘intelligently’ designed, and how evolution is instead at work:
And lastly for now, Dawkins himself explains how the illusion of deliberate design seems to happen (but doesn’t). It starts at about 4:15:
More creationist nonsense, easily dismissed by the…evidence! Your move, Joe (and creationism in general really).
Dawkins: Not Kind Enough to Religion?
Yesterday I stumbled on an hilarious argument against Dawkins in the Guardian:
He just can’t separate science from the debate he has got into with religious people. “Debate” is too kind a word. In a debate you are trying to convince your opponents, but the new atheists have closed off the grey area in which, for a long time in the west, science and religion co-existed.
Actually he’s separated it completely, where the creationists and Muslim fundamentalists in contrast insist science is on their side. And Dawkins’ argument (although he occasionally overreaches into arguing against religion itself) is against the abuses inflicted by religion on reason and critical thought. There are plenty of believers who accept that science and religion can co-exist, whom I don’t recall Dawkins railing against. His issue is with the theists who have closed this grey area off, largely through teaching lies as facts in faith schools, and arguing in a pseudo-scientific way against science like evolution, which they find inconvenient to their literalist beliefs.
Nor does he offer what is surely needed – a blow-by-blow introduction to evolution that starts calmly from the visible evidence all around us. In a telling aside, he is dismissive about the fossil Ida, which he cannot resist telling his readers was massively overhyped. Missing link? You’d have to be an idiot to think that, he grumps … I am not defending the publicity for this fossil, but it typifies the self-regard of the public atheist that when an accessible, immediate, exciting piece of visual evidence for The Descent of Man enters the mainstream, his reaction is to sneer. He doesn’t actually want to persuade, he just wants to be the cleverest kid in the class. Which Darwin never was.
He has explained evolution until he’s blue in the face. I can present clip after clip from show after show, and YouTube segment after segment set up specifically to evidence evolution, but time and again he’s lambasted for being ‘dogmatic’ or ‘militant’ anyway. And I’m not remotely sure what the point is that Jonathan Jones is trying to make about the fossil Ida. Is he suggesting that Ida disproves evolution as it’s understood? Does Dawkins’ attitude towards it invalidate the arguments he’s trying to counter? How can dismissing it (if that’s what he did) invalidate an acceptance of the primacy of critical thought and science in understanding the world and the universe around us? Given the militancy and sheer stupidity of the religious fundamental attack on science, how kind is he supposed to be? If Jones is opposed to Dawkins on religious grounds, why not say so honestly?
George Clooney had an excellent line in ‘Good Night and Good Luck’, which has stuck with me ever since: just because there are two sides of an argument, doesn’t make them equal or equally logical. And Dawkins clearly accepts that in this area you cannot reason with those who reject reason – they must be confronted because their position is mendacious, damaging and wrong. Jones however appears to be from the liberal school which morally relativises every argument, and I couldn’t disagree with his position more strongly.
What If You’re Wrong?
In my recent arguments and debates with creationists and arch theists I’ve been repeatedly confronted with the question ‘what if you’re wrong’, when I admit my atheism. Richard Dawkins perhaps puts it better than I ever could:
A Science Teacher Arguing Against Science
Dawkins’ documentary last night was damned entertaining, and occasionally painfully revealing. And the science teacher at the Islamic faith school who so totally dropped herself in it has responded:
Science is essentially mankind’s best effort at understanding the workings of the known universe, given our limited resources and intelligence. Learning about science is fun, fantastic and thought-provoking, especially discussions arising around ethical grey areas. However, it is important that children are made aware of the limitations of scientific endeavour lest they be corralled into a realm wherein nothing is worth knowing unless it has been determined by empirical scientific discovery.
If they were encouraged towards that worldview alone, I believe they would be receiving an education devoid of further enrichment from a faith-based narrative. I’m not in the business of wanting young people bereft of the entire canon of human belief systems. That religions have stood the test of time is testament to the human need for something other than that which we can prove or disprove.
As a teacher, I’d be doing my pupils a grave disservice if I insisted that the answers that science can give us should be the limit of our understanding of the world. Kids are bright and don’t need liberating from religion, especially if the alternative is limited to giving credence to atheistic secularism alone. Rather, equip them with all the alternatives and let them work it out for themselves.
I’m aghast at this. She’s debating her confrontation with Dawkins about evolution, which she as a science teacher disputed. I’ll accept (to a point) that history has shown at the very least a predilection for something other than what we can prove or disprove, but that has almost entirely been due to historical ignorance – we haven’t been able to figure out the answers about who we are and how we came to be. Now we can, and for her to say that metaphysics should or could in any way answer how humanity, the earth or the universe came to be is objectively wrong. By all means discuss the issues and run through the debates in a religious education class, but science alone does have the answers to these questions – to suggest there are religious/metaphysical/transcendental alternatives is in small or large measure an attempt to indoctrinate children (as Dawkins says) into believing ‘God’ has answers science doesn’t, thereby contributing to robbing them of the freedom to engage with the world critically.
I personally agree with Dawkins that children do need liberating from religion, at least from their parents’. But my bottom line from Erfana Bora’s argument is this: she is doing her pupils a horrible disservice by suggesting as a science teacher that science doesn’t provide all the answers to our understanding of the world – it does. If she disagrees with the theory of evolution, and suggests for a heartbeat that a religious text has any role in any way in explaining how life on earth has come to be, she shouldn’t be teaching science in a school funded by the British taxpayer. Very simple.
Dawkins on Colbert

Last night the great Richard Dawkins went on the Colbert Report to promote his new book ‘The Greatest Show on Earth’. Enjoy.
| The Colbert Report | Mon – Thurs 11:30pm / 10:30c |
| Richard Dawkins | |